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Welcome to Around the Homestead podcast, where we share information on topics from gardens to goats,

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our aim is to provide small farmers and landowners valuable education on projects that may arise around the homestead.

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Whether you have been on the homestead all your life or you have just beginning the farm lifestyle.

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We hope you garner helpful tips to make your rural lifestyle most rewarding.

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Now here are hosts Brad McGinley and Sean Rhoades.

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Hello and welcome to Around the Homestead podcast, I'm your co-host, Brad McGinley, county extension agent in Grant County.

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And today I have my co-host with me. Shaun Rhodes is the county extension agent in Scott County.

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Today, we're going to be covering a little bit about starting a vegetable garden.

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But first, just want to say a little bit about our podcast that we're going to be hope that you're going to stick around with us and

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we're going to be covering on around the homestead anything from vegetable gardens to small scale livestock production,

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farm pond management, wildlife management on the homestead,

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and just hopefully will give you some tips and tricks that'll make your rural lifestyle more enjoyable.

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And we just hope that you'll hang around with us.

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But as far as starting the vegetable garden, you know,

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Shaun, Spring has really sprung up around here and everybody's kind of starting to get it on their mind.

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Absolutely.

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Yeah, we're starting to see some trees bloom and people want to get those things in the ground and enjoy some fresh vegetables this summer.

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You betcha. You betcha. And really, when I think about starting a vegetable garden, you have several different options.

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You know, if you can do the traditional in ground garden that we typically think about that you, like you and I probably had when we were growing up.

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And then there's other options, like a raised bed, straw bale gardening.

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We'll talk a little bit about that here in a little bit. But in terms of just getting a vegetable garden started, let's talk first off,

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let's talk about the site selection and how you really need to narrow down where you want to put your vegetable garden at.

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And so what are some key topics that you think that the home gardeners should

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think about when when thinking about where to put their vegetable garden? Well, first off, no matter what garden you're going to do,

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what method, you need to think about this light shade, even in a morning shade, a lot of shade.

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That's probably the first thing you need to think about because we can't have just like growing grass in our yard.

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We can't grow a garden under a lot of shade.

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So most of the time, evening shade will do you some good and not be so bad.

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But morning shade is usually tried to be avoided because you get those fungus problems.

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You know, with that, do you stay in those plants for a long time in the mornings?

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Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, we typically tell our clientele that they're going to need 6-8 hours of good full sun would be would be ideal.

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You know, like you said, Shaun a little evening shade doesn't hurt things at all,

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especially to help with sun scald on some of your vegetables and kind of give them some relief,

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especially that middle of the summer when that sun is pretty, pretty harsh and in that late in the afternoon.

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So what about you know, one thing I also think about when you're talking about site selection is the soil type.

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If you're doing a traditional garden, you know, in our area, drainage is is a really important thing.

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You know, plants like they like water, but they don't like to stand in wet feet all the time.

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So does that area drain well? Does it you know, we don't want to put those gardens in old crawfishing ground that just don't drain.

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Well, you know, if you go outside and you dig a hole there, when you're thinking about putting your garden out and you fill it up with water,

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if it doesn't drain within 24 hours, you're probably not a good place to put that garden.

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What are your thoughts on on soil type, Shaun? Oh, you know, the way our state is over here where I'm at (Scott County),

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you run into rocks and kind of where you're at and Eastern and you don't they don't see rocks in their gardens.

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I don't guess very much so, we look at it as a is it workable ground?

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You know, does it have too many rocks? Is it having any soil at all?

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Our soil changes within feet here from being, you know, adequately able to grow a garden to probably something you want to just leave alone.

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And so you need to think about that and test that.

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And you can do that. Probably just like with your drainage example there of. Just go out there and dig your hole and and see what happens.

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We want a loamy. Of course, ideal conditions is a loamy sandy-type soil.

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that drains well. That's for a traditional gardening.

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Of course, when you're going to work the ground with a with a plow or tiller tractors or things like that.

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Yeah, and that brings up another good topic, Shaun, is is is if you're going to do a traditional garden,

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what kind of equipment do you have and what kind of equipment do you need to have?

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Yeah, that is a good question, and if somebody is coming at this,

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you know that has it done it before and doesn't have the equipment, that is an important thing to think about.

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You know, we have a lot of people that garden, you know, with a with garden tillers alone.

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Sometimes they may hire a neighbor, somebody that has a small tractor, to come and break their garden, as we call it,

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or till with one of those tillers behind a behind a tractor and a lot of small homesteads I would imagine would have a small tractor.

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And they might want one of those tillers that go behind it that would get your garden ready every year.

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And that's a that's an excellent, excellent method. But there's also some.

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A little bit more high-end type walk-behind tractors that have many implements to them if if that's the route they want to go and don't want to pass,

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I have a tractor and or just a garden tiller to work between the rows.

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Also, you know, I know some guys still that I've worked with that pretty well,

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do all their gardening with the horses or mules and like keeping that tradition alive with the, you know, mule mule drawn equipment.

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And so that's kind of you don't see that much anymore.

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It's pretty neat to see. And that is an option, too, if you're into that.

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Such a thing. Sure, sure. Yeah. There's all kinds of options out there for equipment.

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And I know that we we we have a you know, what goes behind our tractor.

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And it sure does help getting that ground prepped and ready for the garden.

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So another factor that we think about whenever we're planning a garden is where's your water source?

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And that's a big deal because water middle of the summer, Mother Nature is going to turn that, water faucet it off,

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and we're going to probably have to provide some supplemental water in order for this to be successful.

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So, you know, we need to think about where the water is going to come from.

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Yeah, that's very true.

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Whether you are gardening traditional or with some other methods we'll speak about in a moment, uh, water is going to be necessary.

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Now, there's quite a bit of early stuff and things that if you're in a traditional gardening ground, you can probably get away without water.

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But when you start talking about your tomatoes and peppers and some of that later on through the summer crops,

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then you're most likely going to want a water source.

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And so when you think about where you're going to put your garden, if you could put it closer to the house by the water faucet,

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you might want to do that compared to a long ways away where you don't have the the water infrastructure in.

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And so that is very important. It sure is.

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Also, you know, how big how big do want your garden is another consideration,

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you know, because you certainly can grow a lot of a lot of vegetables in a small area.

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And but it's easy also to get real excited about it and make it to big initially.

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Yeah, that's what that's what you see more than more than anything is that they started a little bit big.

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And like I always say, when you get July and August and the weather gets really hot and other things are going on,

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the garden starts seeing some neglect and, you know, you start seeing some weeds get bigger than your plans.

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Yeah, pull on pigweed in the middle of July is not one of my favorite things to do, but unfortunately, it becomes necessary.

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And mine is looks like it has been neglected about middle of July a lot of times.

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Yeah. Mine too, because I'm I'm one of those that tends to get a little bit big when maybe I don't need to be with what I've got time to gather.

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Of course, you know, you got to think about this. The more you have, the more you've got to do something with it.

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And you've got to you've got to go out there and pick that stuff and and then either give it away or put it up or that that takes

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a lot of a lot of time and energy to be planned and prepared to put that stuff up and can it and freeze it and things like that.

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Yeah. So I always tell, you know, any any client that might come in the office where they're starting a garden or

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maybe a home orchard or getting some cows or goats or something for the first time,

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let's let's start small and let's make our mistakes on a small scale, you know, and and learn from there.

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And then we expand out and we can always expand in the future.

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So let's let's talk a little bit about, you know, if you don't have a site for a traditional garden, you know, maybe you don't have workable ground,

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maybe you've got rocks, maybe you've got drainage issues, or maybe you just prefer to have a raised bed garden.

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So, you know, raised-bed gardens are certainly popular, have become more popular.

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And what are some considerations, Shaun, if you want to do a raised bed, what are some things you tell your clients to think about?

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Well, first of all, again, you go back course the water issue. A raised bed it is.

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It's going to require more water than an in-ground garden would.

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You've got to consider what you're going to build that bed out of. There's all types of materials from,

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you know, some like lumber to composite type boards and things like that.

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Of course, you could use bricks or blocks, definitely get away from the rot with those.

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Also what they're going to put in it.

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You know, of course, the reason you're using a raised bed, it is you've got to fill it up with what you're growing media.

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And you know what I am saying,

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and I'm sure you have seen is you don't just go dig some dirt over there and put in a raised bed and be very successful with it.

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It does require a little bit more of a condition, as you might say, or a compost type media to be successful with those.

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Yeah, you know, if you if you just go find some just some topsoil somewhere and you put it in that raised bed,

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it's going to become compacted very quickly and you're not going to be very successful with that.

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We have a pretty good sized school garden here in Sheridan,

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and we have used in our raised beds a mixture of compost that we've got from either the city of Little Rock or the city Hot Springs.

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Your local municipality may have a composting facility that you can go to and get compost.

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We've used a mixture of compost and some high quality topsoil.

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We've mixed that in about a 60 to 40 ratio. And so we like that material because it provides a kind of a lot fluffy material.

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We've even added a little bit of peat moss into there as well, because it allows those roots to become established and it doesn't get compacted.

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But it's also not that topsoil does provide some some kind of keeps it from.

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When we first started, we just used compost and we found that it was almost didn't have a lot of water holding capacity.

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So what does that topsoil does help hold the water just a little bit better and keep the keep the compost from blowing out.

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And it just worked out better for us that way.

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So there's there's a variety of options.

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What you can use in there, you know, your local farm store or may have may have bagged compost that you can you can purchase as well.

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Those are the some of the things that we have used in our area that we've been successful with.

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Right. One note on that is also you're right, a lot of these larger towns and cities do have compost available.

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I know Fort Smith has a lot. They do a big compost program up there.

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And also we are in the process right now to filling some raised beds at a Boys and Girls Club garden project.

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And we have been getting a couple loads of compost from my local landscaping

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company that has their own compost or buying it and bringing it in in bulk.

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And we've done that, too. That is working real well because we're doing pretty much what you said we're going with.

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We're filling those about 60 percent and then we're going to take a bagged top soil and mix that in to finish it.

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Oh, yeah. That works out real well. You know, Shaun, this brings up another topic.

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A lot of times we see people that want to put manure in their gardens, whether it be raised bed or just apply manure to traditional garden.

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And that does while manure is great and wonderful and it does provide some certainly some fertilizer, some organic matter to the soil.

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There are some challenges and some some things we need to think about only when we go to apply manure.

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Yeah, yeah, if if your media contains any type of the manure in it, you need to pay special attention and make sure that you are.

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Confident, you know, the history of that manure and by the history of the manure, I mean,

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was the hay that was fed to the animals that produced that manure and or the pastures that that animal was grazing,

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up on had ever been sprayed with a herbicide, certain herbicides.

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And if it has, then you need to probably shy away from it, from using that product in your compost or in your raised beds.

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Because what can happen is we have a little bit of herbicide carryover that goes through the passes,

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through the animal in the manure and can affect some sensitive crops like tomatoes and peppers and things in your in your garden later on.

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And I'd say even if it was last year's manure, Brad. It doesn't really matter.

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So we've got to be careful with that. Yeah, we do have to be real careful with that.

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You know, we see this every year where we have clients that'll bring particularly tomatoes is what you see it almost the time for me.

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They'll bring that. They'll call with some issues they're having with their tomatoes.

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And and what happens is, is that animal consumes that hay or that forage,

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and it passes right through the animal, out into the manure and and that residual causes herbicide damage.

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And, you know, if if you take that manure and you till it into your garden, it's there for a while and you've got a real issue.

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So just be cautious about your manure source and know where it comes from and ask those questions before you use it.

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Yeah. You know, Brad, I have seen that for several years now.

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Every year I get these questions and I always, always, sometimes get a little bit tickled about you.

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Never you never can get a homeowner or a gardener to admit they've done something to themselves.

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Usually when it comes to this manure herbicide, carry over or over spray with some glysophates

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you know that when those tomatoes are all knotted up and look like shoestrings they think some bugs.

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Got to be doing that, you know, and they can't, get that through sometimes, but it's definitely what it is.

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And unfortunately there's not a great solution to it once you do it, but just keep it tilled up and let the rainfall take care of it over time.

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Yeah it is. And yeah, I've seen the same thing.

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Wives have brought it in and they had to go back and consult with their husbands spraying around.

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You know how that goes. But yeah, it certainly and I think, you know, tomatoes are so sensitive.

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I tell people, you know, you could walk by tomato with a closed jar of 2-4-D and it'll just wilt up overnight, you know?

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Yeah. Yeah, they're sensitive to it.

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So it's just something you need to think about before use manure for sure.

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You know, Shaun, another way of gardening, it's kind of become popular in the past several years as these straw bale gardens.

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And they look pretty interesting. I've never had a lot of experience with those,

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but maybe something for people that that certainly may not have an opportunity for an inground

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garden and maybe they don't have the tools or materials or know how to build a raised bed,

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but they might be able to use straw bales as a garden. Yeah, absolutely.

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You know, somebody in on a patio in the back of their house or apartment, I could imagine could use a straw bale to make the grow some plants.

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And I do recommend, if you want to do that, do a little searching and find the fact sheet or two.

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I know there's one in Washington State and Clemson has a good one about the straw

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bales because there is a procedure you need to go through to condition these bales,

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as I call it, wood fertilizer and water. And you let these bales go through somewhat of a heating process.

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And before you're ready to actually just go to plant, you know, you don't just grab a straw bale and cut a hole in it and plant plant in it.

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You do have a little bit of a process you go through. But other than that, as long as you got a place to put that bale and got a little water.

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You can make that happen. Sure, sure. I've seen some a lot of people be successful with that.

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And so I think it's certainly an option, like I said, for people that might be limited on resources.

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But one thing we didn't talk about, Shaun, I'll circle back to raised beds is.

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You know, you don't really have to have a raised bed, you said people with maybe on a patio or an apartment,

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you certainly can can garden in containers as well. Yeah, that's right.

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I thought about that, too, when I was talking. There were the container garden is, of course, as we know, very popular.

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Also kind of some of the same principles apply to that, that they do they do with the raised beds.

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As far as the media in the barrel goes or in your pot, I would think you'd be using close to the same thing.

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Water is very important again on that, too, because you see most of those that need to be water daily just because of the.

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Small size of the amount of soil you have there around that plant, and it does dry out fairly quick, so water is very important.

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What I have found on the containers, sometimes a lot of people do some inconsistent water and with those.

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And I don't think they're successful as they could be. Yeah, that's true.

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Another thing we really hadn't talked about, Sean, but it's very important, particularly when you're starting to think about where to put your garden.

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That is is soil sampling. We would encourage you to get a small sample.

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Soil sampling is is free to your local county extension office.

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So wherever you're thinking about putting your garden. We would encourage you to take a small sample.

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We'll need about one pint. So go around in the area that you're going to be placed in your garden,

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get about a sample, about four to six inches deep in various spots across there.

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So we want to get an average of the whole area.

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So take some some some sub-samples across that area, mix it all together and bring us a one pint sample from that.

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And you can knock again. You can take it to your local county extension office, can help you get that.

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And again, it is absolutely free service and we would highly encourage you to do that before you get started.

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Yeah, absolutely, it's free, so let's yeah.

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Anything but labor, so yeah, so just to review before we get off of here for today,

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if you're going to be starting a vegetable garden, we want to make sure you're on site selection, that you have full sun.

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We need to consider where you're going to put your where your water source is,

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how big you want your garden and what equipment that you have available.

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If you're going to be doing a raised bed, really consider about what planting material that you're going to be putting in there.

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So that about does it for around the Homestead podcast for today.

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We hope that you'll join us at our next episode of When We Talk and a little bit about soil fertility and some early crops that you can be successful.

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So we hope that you'll join us next time all around the homestead podcast.

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We hope you enjoyed this episode of Around the Homestead podcast.

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To learn more about today's topic, be sure to visit our website at uaex.uada.edu.

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Be sure to join us next time on Around the Homestead Podcast.